May 29, 2026
The Empire Club of Canada Presents
Talent, Technology and Trust: Launch of the Council of Ontario Universities’ AI Task Force Report
Chairman: Saurabh Popat, President, Board of Directors, Empire Club of Canada
Moderator
Vass Bednar, Managing Director, Canadian Shield Institute
Distinguished Guest Speaker
The Honourable Nolan Quinn, Ontario’s Minister of Colleges, Universities, Research Excellence and Security
Panellists
Vivek Goel, President & Vice-Chancellor, University of Waterloo; Chair, COU AI Task Force
Shannon Bell, Executive Vice President, Chief Digital Officer & Chief Information, OpenText
Glenda Crisp, President & CEO, Vector Institute
Head Table Guests
Barbara Zvan, President & Chief Executive Officer, University Pension Plan
Karim Bardeesy, Member of Parliament, Taiaiako’n—Parkdale—High Park
Welcome Address by Saurabh Popat, President, Board of Directors, Empire Club of Canada
Thank you. I’m Saurabh Popat, Chair of the Board here at the Empire Club of Canada, and your host for today’s event.
To formally begin, I would like to acknowledge that we are gathering on the Traditional and Treaty Lands of the Mississaugas of the Credit, and the homelands of the Anishinaabe, the Haudenosaunee, and the Wendat Peoples. I encourage you all to learn more about the Traditional Territory on which you work and live.
Now, today’s event would not be possible without the generous support of our incredible sponsors. The Empire Club is a non-profit organization, and our sponsors generously support the club, and make these events possible and complimentary for our online viewers to attend. So, please join me in thanking our Lead Sponsor, University Pension Plan Ontario. Thank you. Thank you to our VIP Reception Sponsor, McKinsey & Company. Thank you. And to our Supporting Sponsors, eCampus Ontario, Meta, and Pearson Canada. Thank you. And thank you to our Event Partner, Toronto Tech Week. Thank you. We also deeply appreciate the ongoing support of our Lead Season Sponsors, Bruce Power, Hydro One, and National Bank Capital Markets, and our VIP Reception Season Sponsors, Ellis Don, McKinsey & Company, the Ontario Road Builders Association, and Waste Connections of Canada. And finally, thank you to our Media Partner, the Toronto Star, and our AV Partner, Bespoke Audio Visual. Lastly, I want to give a special thank you to Steve Orsini, and the Council of Ontario Universities, for working closely with us on this very, very important event. Thank you.
If you have a question for our speakers, please scan the QR code found on your program, or through the Q&A function, if you’re online. And for those of you online, if you require technical assistance, please use the chat feature.
We are absolutely thrilled to host today’s panel as part of Toronto Tech Week, a citywide celebration of our brilliant innovators, tech visionaries, and leaders building what comes next. And you can’t have a tech week these days without talking about the huge impact AI has had and continues to have. From reshaping entire industries to raising the question of what the future of work might look like and transforming learning.
This club has convened many important conversations on our country’s digital economy and AI readiness. We’ve explored the future of data, the shifting innovation landscape, and how technology will impact the way we prepare our youth for the workforce. In fact, just this season alone, we’ve had two incredible events with Minister Solomon and Don Tapscott, recently. Last year, during a panel on AI revolution, a speaker shared a famous quote from Bill Gates, stating that we always overestimate the change that will occur in the next 2 years, and underestimate the change that will occur in the next 10. That quote perfectly encapsulates the challenge that we face in our province and across our country. The short-term changes facing us are huge. The longer-term changes are even more daunting. We have world-class talent and ambitious research to help us in the near term, yet we have a wide gap when it comes to longer-term execution and commercialization.
That’s why today, ahead of next week’s highly anticipated release of the federal AI strategy, we are going to focus on our moving beyond early stage adoption towards sustained leadership in the global AI economy. This afternoon also serves as the official public launch of the Council of Ontario Universities AI Task Force Report. We will examine how our province can rapidly prepare students for an AI-driven workforce. We will discuss building secure, Canadian-based data infrastructure. And we’ll explore how to support industry in scaling AI to drive productivity across key sectors. It promises to be a deep and textured conversation of national importance. And that’s the kind of conversation we at the Empire Club have welcomed for more than 122 years.
Before we introduce our distinguished panel, I want to invite our Lead Sponsor to the stage. Please welcome Barbara Zvan, President and Chief Executive Officer of the University Pension Plan. Barbara, Barbara is a recognized global pension leader, and a powerful advocate for responsible investing. As a leading institutional investor, she understands the critical role that capital plays in scaling Canadian innovation and securing long-term economic growth for our province. Please, join me in welcoming Barbara to the podium.
Opening Remarks by Barbara Zvan, President & Chief Executive Officer, University Pension Plan
So good, good afternoon everyone. And I’m a little embarrassed, because I brought paper, because I figured this was really important. I can’t, as a good risk manager, not come with a backup. I would like to let you know that this was not AI-generated. And so, and I want to welcome everybody, and congratulations to the Council of Universities on the launch of the AI Task Force Report. And on behalf of the University Pension Plan, it is a pleasure to be here for today’s conversation.
You know, at UPP, we serve a sector built on research, collaboration, critical thinking, and the pursuit of new ideas. And as a long-term pension investor for Ontario universities, we see firsthand how AI is reshaping workplaces, capital markets, and the skills of our members and their employers will need. That makes today’s discussion deeply relevant for us. And as a partner to the people and institutions helping shape Ontario’s future, AI is simply not a technology story. It’s a leadership story, a workforce story, a competitiveness story, and ultimately, a trust story.
While AI is moving incredibly quickly, realizing its potential will depend on combining innovation with human judgment, strong governance, and public confidence. We see that in our own work at UPP, where we’re exploring how AI can help improve productivity, make complex information more accessible, and pensions are complex. And while always keeping human expertise, risk management, and member trust at the centre. It’s a reminder of the value of these tools depends on how thoughtfully we use them. And that’s why today’s discussion is so significant. Ontario universities have a critical role to play in preparing students, advancing research, and helping Canada compete in increasingly AI-enabled economy. And as Lead Sponsor of today’s event, we are so proud to support this conversation, and the Council’s leadership in charting a path forward.
It is now my pleasure to introduce Honourable Nolan Quinn, Ontario’s Minister of Colleges, University, Research Excellence and Security, whose work is helping to strengthen Ontario’s post-secondary sector research capacity, workforce readiness, for an increasingly AI-enabled economy. Please, join me in welcoming Minister Nolan Quinn.
The Honourable Nolan Quinn, Ontario’s Minister of Colleges, Universities, Research Excellence and Security
Good afternoon, everyone. Before I start in my formal remarks, I think it’s the second or third time I’ve seen the national anthem played in the three languages in Canada. And I don’t know if it’s just me, or if it’s the geopolitics of the world, but it gives me goosebumps every time I hear that. So, I think it’s worth acknowledging your national anthem.
So, good afternoon, everyone. It’s a pleasure to be with so many leaders and innovators from Ontario’s AI ecosystem. And I wanna congratulate the Council of Ontario Universities for releasing “Charting a Path Forward for Ontario Universities in the Age of AI.” It’s an important contribution to one of the most pivotal conversations facing our province today. How do we prepare students for an AI-driven workforce, while ensuring AI is developed and adopted in a way that is responsible, secure, and trusted? There’s no two ways about it. AI is reshaping how we work, it’s reshaping how we learn, and it’s reshaping our economy. If we wanna continue building one of the most competitive economies in the G7, Ontario must be ready to adapt, leverage, and advance AI.
Our government knows that to protect Ontario, we need to protect Ontario’s talent pipeline. That means making sure our students receive world-class cutting-edge education to succeed in careers that Ontario needs. Which is why earlier this year, we announced our $6.4 billion new funding model for our colleges, universities, and Indigenous institutes. This is one of the—[Applause]—this is one of the largest investment in post-secondary education, not only in Ontario, but Canadian history. And as I shared earlier this week, through this new funding model, we’re funding 70,000 additional seats in high-demand programs, including STEM. That means more students gaining the skills they need to utilize AI in their future careers, more graduates ready to lead Ontario’s tech sector, and more AI innovation taking place in our own backyard.
Since 2019, 2020, the number of graduates from AI-related programs in Ontario has more than doubled, with over 10,000 graduates in ‘24, ‘25 alone. It’s clear students want to work in this exciting field, and we’re proud to expand enrollment to meet that demand. But building an AI-ready workforce is not just about creating more seats, it’s also about advancing AI research to ensure Ontario industries stay on the cutting edge of innovation. Since we have taken office, we’ve invested over $2 billion in Ontario-made research. This includes nearly $74 million to support over 160 AI-related research projects across the whole province. This funding is driving AI-enabled advances across key sectors, including the life sciences, manufacturing, and core computer and data sciences, giving researchers the secure, high-performance infrastructure they need to develop and scale AI solutions right here in Ontario. A great example of this is our $2 million investment at the University of Waterloo to develop secure, privacy-protecting data and AI, so our financial, tech, and manufacturing sectors can operate safely in the digital economy.
What I love most about this project, and the many more like it, is that it’s driven by responsible and safe use of AI. Because with any other great discovery, there’s also risk with the increased use of AI. And as we continue to harness the power of artificial intelligence in our institutions, our workplaces, and our economy, it must be done in a way that protects what we hold most dear, our people and our province.
AI leadership doesn’t happen by accident. It’s built through deliberate investments in talent and research, the sharing of ideas and best practices, the clear guiding principles. It is not adoption for adoption’s sake. It is about adopting AI in a strategic way, a way that advances our industries, strengthens our workforce, and positions our province as one of the most competitive economies in the G7. By working together, we can shape how AI is developed, applied, and trusted, not just in our institutions, but across all of Ontario. Thank you all for your dedication to building a more prosperous and secure future for Ontario. I really hope you enjoy the rest of the discussion today. Thank you.
Saurabh Popat
Thank you, Minister Quinn, for your excellent remarks, and taking time out of your busy schedule to be here with us today. We appreciate your leadership, insights, and as we navigate through this period of rapid technological change. It’s now time to bring these ideas together for our panel discussion. To guide today’s discussion, we’re joined by Vass Bednar. Vass is the Managing Director of the Canadian Shield Institute. She is recognized as one of our country’s sharpest policy minds, and is known for asking the direct and necessary questions. She brings experience across government, academia, and media, that makes her the perfect moderator for our chat today.
Joining Vass is Vivek Goel, President and Vice Chancellor of the University of Waterloo, and the Chair of the Council of the Ontario Universities AI Task Force. Vivek has a distinguished record of leadership across our public health and academic sectors. He joins us here today to share his expertise on how we can play, on how we can rapidly prepare our students for an AI-driven workforce.
We also welcome Glenda Crisp, President and CEO of the Vector Institute. Glenda brings more than 35 years of experience building enterprise data strategies, and leading complex technology transformations. Her perspective is essential, as we explore how to turn our research strengths into real commercial outcomes.
And finally, please welcome Shannon Bell, the Executive Vice President and Chief Digital Officer and Chief Information Officer at OpenText. Shannon is a seasoned technology leader, known for driving large-scale change across global markets. She understands exactly what it takes to scale Canadian innovation, and accelerate business growth.
Please, join me in giving a warm welcome to Vass, Vivek, Glenda and Shannon.
Vass Bednar, Managing Director, Canadian Shield Institute
I love a walk-on song. It’s cozy up here. You guys are good. I can see all of you. To me, that’s the most important thing. You can see each other. Okay, we don’t wanna have any lines blocked there. Thank you to the Empire Club, and thank you to all of you for joining us. Thank you for the Task Force Report, as well, which trust me, I have read, and everyone will be checking out. I think what I’m most appreciative of is this opportunity to sort of start to continue the bigger conversation around AI, and acknowledge how our post-secondary institutions and adjacent institutions can capture all of the good, harness the good, and out with the bad. And I think, you know, in fair Verona where we lay our scene, there’s a good energy in this room. Because we are all trying to figure out not who did this, but how to make the most of this technology acknowledging that it’s here and that we’re not at its full potential yet.
I am not a member of the Task Force, or the panel. I’m just the moderator. So, I will now start moderating. But where I wanted to start, actually, is around preparing students. We have about one-fifth, at least, of the room here today who are post-secondary students—shout out to the next generation. And I’ll say, when I was coming of age studying, it was techno-optimism time. And the key message was, wow, the job you’re gonna have in the future probably doesn’t even exist yet. But it was, everyone was excited about that. No one was worried about that. It was about creation. Many worry that now, a lot of the narrative is, okay, the person you wanna be, the expertise and skills that you are building, could vanish very soon. And you’re gonna have to figure that out. Wow, very exciting. Not motivating, lot of anxiety.
So, with AI starting to augment the labour market, lots of speculation that for new grads, and you know, the uncertainty right now, that could be a reason there’s some hiring being held back, right? How do and how can universities prepare students for careers and roles, forget just the may not existing yet, but that are fundamentally going to be in a state of flux? How can we do that? And maybe Vivek, I could start with you.
Vivek Goel, President & Vice-Chancellor, University of Waterloo; Chair, COU AI Task Force
Sure, thanks. It’s a great question. It’s also great to have so many students here, and thank the Empire Clubs for including the students, and we’ll have an opportunity with the panel to have further dialogue with the students afterwards, as well; I’m really looking forward to that. One thing, I wanna correct something that Saurabh said in the introduction about preparing for an AI-driven workforce. Because I think we need to prepare for a human-driven workforce.
Vass Bednar
Okay.
Vivek Goel
We’re gonna have all these technologies, but what is it that humans are going to do in that world? And I think that’s the question that we have to pose ourselves, as we think about how we prepare our students. I think you touched on the jobs that might not exist, and you know, it was 5 years, 10 years, 15 years—now, those jobs are getting created on a daily basis, right?
Vass Bednar
M’hm (affirmative).
Vivek Goel
And so, in terms of preparing our students, we have to prepare them to be adaptable and flexible. And we have to prepare them with, traditionally we might’ve talked about soft skills. Again, I’ll say, let’s call them the human skills, critical thinking, teamwork, collaboration, problem solving. And we have to do that in very different ways. Not necessarily different—I’m coming from Waterloo—so, work integrated learning, experiential learning, is going to be the way in which we ensure students are able to acquire the kinds of skills that are gonna be necessary in such a rapidly-changing world.
And then the final thing I’ll say is, while we have a very important focus on students, they’re the generation that’s going to really have to work with all these changes, but we also have to think about everyone that’s already out there. We’re all—you know, I got asked, if you read the Globe and Mail, about how am I using AI? We’re all trying to figure this out ourselves, and our institutions also have a critical role to play in providing AI literacy programs for everyone across society.
Vass Bednar
So Shannon, what are employers looking for? I imagine you’re not yet sending an AI to conduct an interview. Nobody wants to do an interview, and you sort of see someone like reading answers to a question. That’s not what we’re looking for here. What are employers looking for when they’re making that big decision to invest in the talent of tomorrow?
Shannon Bell, Executive Vice President, Chief Digital Officer & Chief Information, OpenText
I think, so a couple points—and Vivek said it really well, looking for critical thinking and problem solving skills, more than experience with a specific language model. Because if I look at our developers, they change which language model they want to use on a weekly basis. And so, no sense really focusing on just one, having adaptability across different technologies. We’re knee-deep in our AI deployment. We’ve been really focused on our agentic AI deployment. And one of the things that’s come very clear to us is humans are setting the direction and AI is delivering the acceleration. And we talk a lot about humans in the loop, and humans on the loop. That is actually the reality of how we’re running agentic today. We’re not, the technology is good, but it’s not good enough to run purely autonomously, to run mission critical operations supporting hundreds of thousands of customers around the world.
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Shannon Bell
And so, if you think about that in the context of humans in the loop, and human setting the direction, for us, we’re looking for students that have a broad set of experiences, have some business savviness, in addition to the technology skills.
Vass Bednar
Okay.
Shannon Bell
And I think that’s becoming more and more important, understanding business outcomes. Because AI is really about taking a set of business problems, and then using technology to deliver those. It’s not just a technology problem. So, having that link into understanding business, business problems, outcomes, how you analyze those problems, and think through them becomes kind of the magic in coupling it with a technology degree.
Vass Bednar
And Glenda, you’ve been so patient. Thank you. I’m gonna stick with you, and give you my follow up question, too, so—but from Vector’s perspective, what are you seeing? Because you get to see all kinds of academic talent, and transitioning to commercialization, and frontier modelling, and everything.
Glenda Crisp, President & CEO, Vector Institute
Yeah. So, and we actually spend a lot of time with companies, so both startup scale ups and multinationals, and you know, I’ve had a lot of these conversations over the last month. And I would say three things that I’ve heard. One is—and this was from somebody who’s running a relatively young startup company, specifically asked, are you still gonna hire university grads? And he said, absolutely. He said, I’m still looking for deep domain expertise, right? So, you know, understanding that sector that you’re in. Also, I’ve been hearing—again to echo, so you can take it as this is clearly needed—critical thinking, right? So, those courses in university, that process you go through, is very important. And then the third thing—and I will say, I heard this from a bank executive last evening, specifically asked, what’s the thing that’s a differentiator when you hire? And he said, attitude. And his example was, I want these university grads that understand business, and understand the tech. And this is a guy that is deeply technical, and he said, they just understand it in a way I don’t. And they can come into the bank and challenge me, and say, why is this process taking 50 steps? It should take three, and you should be using these agents. And so, he’s looking for the young talent coming out of universities to have that ability to say, here’s how we can actually do better.
Vass Bednar
M’hm (affirmative).
Glenda Crisp
So—and I am hearing that it’s absolutely about humans with.
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
With. It’s not instead of.
Vass Bednar
With that in mind, you know what I was just thinking about? I was thinking about the literature on home appliances, and the promise of more time being created for women, and how actually with the adoption of that technology, you know, that it creates more housework. And so, that’s where my mind is when I was like, agents, you’re still in the loop, it’s just something else to monitor. We’re, you know, we’re getting there. People are right adopting the technology, finding ways that it works for them, finding ways that it works for their firm, and still keen to invest in talent is what we’re hearing.
Driving that impact across the economy, you know, you could do a whole Heritage Minute on Canada’s research and development of foundational AI knowledge. And to say that we are weaker in adoption and commercialization is really kind of dressing it up in a very Canadian way, too, because we’re so brutal at that. And, you know, everyone is trying to figure out how we can level up, in that regard. I’d love to hear from each of you where you see AI already creating an impact, and how you see universities help accelerating that. I’ll stick with you, Glenda, if…
Glenda Crisp
Sure.
Vass Bednar
…you don’t mind, just sort of bring it back.
Glenda Crisp
So, the Vector Institute is one of the three National AI Institutes, and we work with universities coast-to-coast. I’d love to add the North Coast, at some point. But yeah, so we work to basically attract and retain top research here. And there’s so many advances that it’s frankly hard to stay on top of. So, we have 962 researchers alone, but safety of AI is a strength for this country. All three National Institutes have researchers in that space. Health is a strength for this country, and not just because of the research that’s going on, but because of the data that we have. If we can actually organize our health data better, make it more available for researchers, we can unlock all kinds of products…
Vass Bednar
Absolutely.
Glenda Crisp
…and services that could be exported, globally. So, there’s riches that we are sitting on top of, but we need to, I think, get out of our own way, and start digging in, and saying, okay, instead of hoarding my data here in Ontario, let me combine that with Québec and Alberta. And the feds have funded the vital platform to do just that, so that researchers can get that cross-section.
Shannon Bell
I think that, you know, from an OpenText perspective, we’re a Canadian company that was born out of the University of Waterloo 35 years ago, the majority of our customers are actually in the regulated industries in government.
Vass Bednar
Okay.
Shannon Bell
And so, that puts us in an interesting position because Canada is actually very trusted when you look, globally. And most of our business is outside of Canada. And so, governments look at us as a trusted partner in Canada to protect data, to bring solutions around trusted and protected AI. And that’s led to a lot of the work that’s being done around sovereign, and sovereign data, sovereign AI, and what that means around the world in terms of data protection in light of some of the geopolitics. And so, I think there’s a nice opportunity there to marry some of the research that’s being done with the commercialization aspect. And I completely agree, we haven’t done a good enough job. And coming as a technology vendor, one of our realizations is it’s much easier to sell outside of Canada than it is for technology vendors to sell here at home, which seems really…
Glenda Crisp
Crazy.
Shannon Bell
Crazy. Absolutely, right? But I know that’s part of some of the discussions happening in Ontario around buy Ontario, buy Canadian. But that is largely why, from a research perspective, many of the startups end up going south of the border, and we lose the commercialization aspect. So, I do think there’s a balancing act that’s to be had. I think there’s a great opportunity. I think AI makes technology innovation more accessible. And so, I do expect, and I do hope coming out of some of the work that’s been done in the task force, that we actually see more and more innovation coming out of universities, and driving more commercialization, in addition to the research. Obviously, Canada wants to maintain its leadership role, but I think that commercialization piece for innovators, for startups, for students thinking about what they wanna do with technology, huge opportunity.
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
Can I just build on that?
Vass Bednar
A hundred percent.
Glenda Crisp
I promise, Vivek, you’ll get a chance. But I do get to meet with a lot of startups. And the thing that they tell me is that they are asked for US references. Who have you sold to in the US?
Vass Bednar
Yeah. By VCs, right?
Glenda Crisp
By Canadian corporate.
Vass Bednar
Interesting.
Glenda Crisp
And so, we kind of, we definitely need to stop that.
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
We need to start, if the startup has a solution for your business problem, be the first customer. Be the second customer, help them grow.
Vass Bednar
Yeah. Vivek, I am coming to you. I do wanna signal, I’d like to take, there’s a special student question coming up. So, we’ll queue it up for what’s next. But Shannon, we could also do a whole segment on those buy Canadian and even buy Ontario definitions. You could, I don’t know what analogy I should use, but if we count a wholly-owned foreign subsidiary that has an address here and files taxes as a Canadian company, then procuring from, I don’t know, I’ll just say, you know, Microsoft Canada doesn’t really fill the bucket of what we’re trying to do. And so, a lot of the time when we are trying to purchase Canadian and literally counting that, oops, we’re not doing it. And maybe, AI can help with that, who knows. You’ve been patient now. So, how are we gonna drive that impact across the economy?
Vivek Goel
Yeah. And I’ll start by saying, certainly universities and research organizations have an important role to play, and there’s always more we could do. But if we’re gonna be successful, it requires all sectors working together, private sector and governments. You know, Vector exists because Jeff Hinton tried desperately to sell his technology to Canadian firms, and couldn’t, and eventually sold to Google. And you know, there’s a valid criticism that that IP that was developed based on many decades of Canadian research agency investment leaked out of the country. But it’s not because Jeff wanted to take it out of the country. And the genesis of Vector was that he saw all of the graduates from his research program being hired by the big American companies, as well as some other global companies. And so, Vector got created to try to keep some of that talent, and to draw more talent into Canada.
So, if we’re really gonna succeed on this, we need to get to work on the absorptive capacity, creating more firms like OpenText that will then be able to bring in the technology that our innovators and entrepreneurs are developing. And I think that first buy—I mean, I hear the opposite, Glenda, because we hear from our entrepreneurs, when they’re going to global markets say, who are you selling to in Canada? So, they get kind of at it both ways. We all know—and Barb, the pension funds have to do better, using all that great Canadian wealth—we’re the best institutional investors in the world, investing more in those Canadian startups to build up the ecosystem at all stages. The purchasing side in the healthcare system, health data. But you could apply that…
Glenda Crisp
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Vivek Goel
…across any number of sectors, where we would have so much advantage in Canada.
Vass Bednar
Sounding like a lot of these firms have something in common with new grads. You know, it’s been that post-2008 elevation of five years of experience for entry-level work, when it’s like, well, what experience do you have? It’s like, okay, we gotta find ways to recognize all sorts of meaningful experiences, before, you know, you’re getting that first purchase order, or that first position. And critical thinking happens in all sorts of ways, in all sorts of places. Would it work now to hear our student question on screen? This is where the moderator gets a little bit extra help. She phones a friend, and she doesn’t forget that she has the very special question. No, I think it’s coming up on screen.
Video Question from Matt Linn, Mechanical Engineering, Lassonde School of Engineering, York University
Hello, my name is Matt Linn, and I’m a mechanical engineering student at York University. Dr. Goel, as Ontario prepares students for an AI-German economy, what is the single most important structural change universities must make to ensure that graduates are trained to challenge, explain, and validate AI system responses, rather than just depending on them as black box tools? Thank you.
Vass Bednar
Thank you, Matt.
Vivek Goel
Well, thanks, Matt. I had a chance to chat with Matt a few minutes ago, and Matt’s a mechanical engineering student, and also plays on the football team. And I think that reflects what’s so important about the university experience, because it’s not just about the programs that you take, but it’s about everything that you do, your co-curricular, your extracurricular activities. Those are the ways in which you develop the life skills to be ready, to be adaptable, and to work in the kind of world that we’re going into. I think, for me, the most significant, immediate structural change is that we all work together on improving AI literacy within our institutions, as well as across society. And by AI literacy, I don’t mean turning them into one of Vector’s research scientists, right? That’s a very specific skillset. We need that frontier research to be continuing. But we need every member of society, and that means every student, every employee at our institutions, having that basic knowledge of how to use AI tools, and most importantly, how to critically assess what comes out, how to pose the right prompts. Those are the human skills that will allow people to work with AI.
And then finally—and this might be a stretch for a year, but I think we have a very urgent challenge around this which we outlined in the report, is we need to ensure that everyone has access to those tools. And we need to address the concerns that we have around data protection, data privacy, the use of our data in training of models, data sovereignty. And so, how do we build out that sovereign AI stack that is gonna be accessible and available to everyone? Because we can do the AI literacy, but if people don’t have access, they’re not gonna be able to work with the tools.
Vass Bednar
I’m glad you mentioned that. It’s a very exciting part of the conversation, and we will get there. I also wanna talk about just the role of post-secondary institutions, and how the technology is transforming them, is going to transform them. I was thinking, calling back to the recent Auditor General’s report, the Ontario report that was like, okay, only 3% of provincial public servants did the AI training. Very few people use the like sanctioned AI systems, and then people had used, it was like something, the number was 600, or around 600 AI systems. I was reading that thinking, wow, I didn’t really know there were 600. You know what I mean? Like, you know, what’s out there? What’s happening? How are people using it? And how can we use it more effectively?
The report hits on, appropriately, that, you know, AI isn’t just like grabbing a CD-ROM off the shelf and uploading it, that it’s providing a transformative layer. What does like real change look like, in practice? And do you really think universities are prepared to change? Because like, let’s face it, they are, they can be remarkably resilient to the C word. Who wants to start? You made eye contact in the middle. So, you could speculate. You could just be like, I’m not sure. I mean, you’re on the Task Force.
Shannon Bell
I think university education is about learning to learn, in my opinion. And I think that, you know, while courses and programs and structures may need to change to embrace AI, and to look at how you’re using AI, and still teaching the critical thinking skills, and not continuing with the same program that might allow people to just use AI to do the course. So, I think there’s some structural changes required around enforcing those skills. But I think the learning to learn aspect of it needs to remain. I think the literacy piece that Vivek spoke about is critical in reducing fear of use. And I think that for me is kind of, from a practical workplace perspective, the number one issue. When we started to roll out AI tools, you know, our security teams wanted us to be very cautious. And what we realized quickly was if we didn’t give people access, they were just gonna go access it anyways. And then, they were gonna be putting confidential data into these tools in the public domain. And so, it’s kind of always that balancing act, giving access, increasing literacy, and then, you know, educating people on the art of the possible with those tools. And so, I think that’s a piece that universities must embrace. And it comes back a little bit to experiential learning, and giving people opportunities to see how technology can be used in the workplace, and then going back, and applying that in an educational context. And so, I think that’s kind of the marrying of the two. That’s important.
Vivek Goel
If I could just, you know, I’ll acknowledge universities can take time to change. And they have lots of processes, but sort of big organizations, governments, you’ve mentioned the Ontario Civil Service. But universities do change. When I started post-secondary education, I hate to say 50 years ago almost, I had a slide rule and a typewriter that I took with me, right?
Vass Bednar
Sweet.
Vivek Goel
And I go to the library, and there’s card catalogs, and I have to go and get books, read the articles, take notes, write my papers. Like if you think about the digital world that we live in, and how our institutions run today, what I started in is medieval, right? And we have changed. The difference now, I think, is the pace of change is gonna be much, much faster. And our systems, our governance bodies, curriculum committees, senates, and so on, are gonna have to adapt to that faster pace of change, just like governance. You know, Minister Solomon was on this stage talking about moving at the speed of the technology—now, his report is six months late. It sounds like….
Glenda Crisp
I’m with you. Six months late.
Vivek Goel
It shows—sorry, Kareem—but governments, we’re all challenged with moving at the speed that we need to move at.
Vass Bednar
It’s funny, I mean, it’s not like I had an abacus or anything at school, but what people used to say—again, just this throwback, right? It was like, “Whatever you do, do not cite Wikipedia.” And I was like, “No, like I’m not gonna do that.” And like now today, it’s like I’m reading the news on an app, and it’s like Wikipedia’s under attack for being seen as authoritative on the internet. So times, they do change. Anything you wanted to build on?
Glenda Crisp
Yeah. I think for me, there’s kind of two things that I think universities need to do. The one is outlined with what came out in the report, which is that AI literacy piece. And it really needs to flow through every single discipline and department. And I’ll use myself as an example. I, back in the olden days, grew up in a house that actually had a PC, before this was common.
Vass Bednar
Sweet. Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
None of my friends had this. And I never touched it, because I was afraid.
Vass Bednar
Oh, wow.
Glenda Crisp
And it was expensive, and I didn’t wanna break it. And I have now had 35-plus years in technology. And the reason I had my career is because I went for Bachelor of Commerce degree, which I thought did not have a mandatory computer class, showed up, and found out it had a mandatory computer class…
Vass Bednar
Wow.
Glenda Crisp
…found that I loved programming. So, my entire career happened because my university forced me to learn how to code. It would not have been my choice. And so, I think AI is the same. You have to, in this day and age, understand what it’s good at, what’s not good at, how to apply it. And how can you take it, and make something really amazing?
And then I think the second thing universities need to really think through on the structure is the governance. You have to govern. And governance is not saying, I wish everything would slow down and stop—which I think we all every day say, just please, can we have a minute? It’s not going to stop. The AI advances. Think of it as trying to stop waves in the ocean. You can’t. It’s going to continue. So, what we need is governance that’s adaptive, that’s automated, probably uses some AI in there, as well, to help like highlight things we should look at. But we really need to get good at governance that enables innovation. Governance that speeds adoption.
Vass Bednar
I really like what you said about an institutional experience forcing you to do something, not because it’s autocratic, but because the university has a space to be pulled out of your comfort zone as a necessity, versus you know what is sometimes interpreted as a, you know, choose your own adventure, navigate. You’re attracted to what you like and what you’re good at, which is sometimes maybe not what you should be. You know, you need friction. So, hearing, you know, bringing that friction, integrating that friction. How are we going to—I mean, there’s so much I want to ask and I do want to get to the iPad. Thank you to people who sent questions on the iPad. They’re spicy, I will get to them. I think I sort of knocked post-secondary—of course, I didn’t mean to do that—but PSE has historically been a site where we do build infrastructure, and we do build sovereign infrastructure. So, you know, Canary as this like historic example of kind of like a research intranet, but that, you know, has a national scope is, you know, still figuring things out. Part of our history here, what can be part of our future, when we sort of bring that institutional imagination?
Vivek, you were mentioning, you know, sovereignty, owning, governing that technology. How can universities be a part of that, more than just a part of it? Because next week, we have that big sovereign compute call closing. So, what should we be watching for and thinking about, in terms of building up the infrastructure for this technology?
Vivek Goel
I’ll start—I’m sure Shannon will have something to say, as well. So, I think, obviously, the compute is a critical piece, the models and the data, as Glenda said. You know, I think, and it’s not just universities, but we can certainly be part of the coalitions that come together to build up that sovereign stack. And, you know, I think we have to think about how do we develop AI models that fit for purpose with what we need to do. And maybe, they won’t be right at the frontier, but they’ll be good enough and build up the expertise, the capacity, the talent in our institutions, the students, to be able to continue to develop that, and you know, working with other countries that are in a similar geopolitical space is that we are, build it out, so that we have some competition to the hyperscalers.
Shannon Bell
I think that if you think about AI, it’s really a stack, as you said, it’s not just one thing. And so, you know, we talk a lot about sovereign compute, giving us the ability to run the models, train the models, and give access to compute to the organizations that need it to run. You think about the model layer, I think Cohere is doing an absolutely terrific job defining a role for themselves in that enterprise model space, where they can be truly differentiated. And they’re obviously benefiting from the fact that they are Canadian, and that is one of the trusted partners around the world. You know, on top of that, you look at the application stack, you look at, you know, building agentic capabilities. And so, there’s lots of opportunities to differentiate. And I think the fact that we can do that in a sovereign, in a sovereign way, with trusted data, and building around that, gives us a great opportunity, and gives us an opportunity to really define a role that the universities can play in helping to build the knowledge base around delivering.
Vass Bednar
I have a question, actually, that’s suggested by one of our participants today. So, thank you to Shannon or Glenda. So, I’ll toss it to Glenda first. Any thoughts around what the AI industry can do, or is doing to advocate publicly for the regulation of AI to provide beneficial outcomes for labour markets, the environment, and IP holders?
Glenda Crisp
So….
Vass Bednar
Or is it too big? I know, it’s tricky, because we’re running out of time, I know. Sorry.
Glenda Crisp
That’s a good question, and it’s a deep question. So, I would say I’ve actually started speaking out first on foundations. So, our data privacy legislation is from 1983. PIPEDA is early 2000’s. So, let’s get that stuff updated soon.
Vass Bednar
Isn’t it industry that sort of stopped us from doing that when we had some—It’s not that Canada hasn’t tried. That’s all I’m gonna say.
Glenda Crisp
Yeah. But I think now, look, that privacy legislation was written before AI exploded, before…
Vass Bednar
It’s true.
Glenda Crisp
…generative AI.
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
And I think there is basic work that needs to be done, especially as we think about how data is consumed by Large Language Models, and what’s the data rights. In terms of artists, in terms of writers, et cetera. So, I think there’s some foundations. But certainly, there’s also—and I know the federal government’s working on online safety, et cetera. So, there are pieces that…
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
…do need to be worked on. And IP is part of that. We certainly have partnered with IP Ontario, and we work with our startups to get them into IP Ontario to protect and patent. But I would also advise people, patents, it’s one mechanism. It’s…
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
…not the whole story.
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
But I don’t know if Shannon has….
Vass Bednar
As we wind in our last minute, just, I’ll ask you all the same thing very quickly. Anything that didn’t quite fit in this report that we can expect in the next one, or anything that was a really spicy, like group text message, where we had to spend extra time in the panel, because we’ve got a united front, and I like that. But these are tricky questions. Just as a way to close, you know, maybe what’s still on your mind, what’s lingering.
Vivek Goel
So, I’ll start from the Task Force perspective. We had—and several members of the Task Force are here today, and really thank them for the work—we had some very spicy discussions about, you know, because nobody really knows what the future’s gonna look like. And you see, AI’s disrupting the workforce, AI’s not disrupting it. Every day there’s a different headline, it’s, your head starts to spin. We know it’s gonna change. But you know, the impact on research, and we’ve talked a lot about students and workforce preparation, but the impacts on research are things that we haven’t really started to think about. Last week, one of OpenAI’s models solved an 80-year-old math problem that no mathematician had been able to solve.
Vass Bednar
Yes. Yes.
Vivek Goel
Like, we’re seeing things happening. Now, when you drill into that, it’s not that it was more creative or more brilliant, it was that to solve that problem, you had to bring a lot of different disciplines together that our mathematicians aren’t traditionally prepared in. And so, the AI was able to bring a whole bunch of different knowledge bases together in a way no human had done before.
Vass Bednar
And hopefully, it didn’t use any hallucinated citations or entirely fake journals to teach it how to solve the math problem.
Vivek Goel
But the proof is validated.
Vass Bednar
I’ll keep winding down. Quick final thoughts.
Shannon Bell
Quick final thought is that AI’s changing so quickly, to your point. It’s not like there’s people with 30 years of experience building agentic AI solutions in the workplace. And so, I think it was a huge opportunity for new grads. I think there’s a huge opportunity to invest in building out the skills, to be able to take advantage of the technology, use the technology to solve problems. It doesn’t matter what problems, solve problems with technology, so you have practical applications of it that you can then translate into the workplace.
Glenda Crisp
Yeah, my final thought is speed. We’ve all got to, like, get some running shoes on here? And that’s everybody. So, from adoption, corporate partners, people doing startups. Governments, seriously, buying compute. The UK bought their national AI compute in three weeks.
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
Weeks. We’re two years in.
Vass Bednar
Yeah.
Glenda Crisp
So, we really like, we need to set some big ambitious, can we do it super fast and let’s get going.
Vass Bednar
Running shoes and critical thinking, I’ll take it. Thank you so much.
Vivek Goel
Perfect.
Saurabh Popat
Wow, what an incredible panel discussion. Thank you Vass, Vivek, Glenda, and Shannon. Truly outstanding conversation. You’ve given us a practical view of what it takes for our province and our country to turn this technological shift into real economic strength. We appreciate your time and your expertise, as well as the recommendations around running shoes and critical thinking—so, I’ll work on that myself. I would be remiss if I didn’t also mention the journey that many of our colleges and college students, some of whom are here today, are on this journey with us, and Colleges Ontario leader who’s representing, representing Colleges Ontario today, Dr. Maureen Addison. So, thank you Maureen, for joining us, as well.
Before we conclude our program, we’re pleased to welcome one more speaker. Karim Bardeesy is the Member of Parliament for Taiaiako’n—Parkdale—High Park and Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Industry. He’s a dedicated public servant today but in his previous work he co-founded a policy think tank focused on technology and education and previously led major policy initiatives for the government of Ontario. He’s earned a reputation as a rare blend of bookishness and boundless enthusiasm. Karim joins us to share how public policy can advance innovation, and secure long-term economic growth across our country. Please, join me in welcoming MP Karim Bardeesy.
Note of Appreciation by Karim Bardeesy, Member of Parliament, Taiaiako’n—Parkdale—High Park
Thank you, Saurabh. Great pleasure to be here with you today. I’m also joined today by Chi Nguyen who’s the Member of Parliament for Spadina—Harbourfront, there at table 40. I want to welcome other elected officials who are in the room today. As Saurabh mentioned, I co-founded the Dais Public Policy Think Tank at Toronto Metropolitan University, and taught undergrads at University of Ryerson University, which became at Toronto Metropolitan University, and policy graduate students at University of Toronto’s School of Public Policy and Governance, now the Munk School, which is where our moderator and I first met.
[Remarks in French]. And I think the representation in this conversation, I think there’s one way to think about this conversation, which is about the encountering of an irresistible force and an immovable object—I’ll just let you decide which is which. On the one hand, you have storied institutions more storied than this club, than this hotel, than this country, with governance that goes back to those eras. And on the other hand, you’ve got technology that was kind of developed decades ago, but written off by many, and then in the last 10 years has taken off, and is now posing existential questions to a number of institutions, storied institutions, but even older institutions.
I don’t know if anyone here has been reading Magnifica Humanitas, but Vivek was talking about his slide rule and his typewriter. Perhaps, there’s a case for the reintroduction of Latin in a few more of our classrooms, so that we can access the papal edicts on this subject, and I think a very actually useful complimentary reading to the Task Force Report today.
As you know, Industry Canada, as you know, the Government of Canada is very invested in a whole bunch of AI-related files, including on research, and we are joined by our friends here at the Vector Institute. The theme of this event, Talent and Trust, I think you will see those themes reflected in the strategy that Minister Solomon is going to be bringing out. I think the recommendations will be well received. Fundamentally, AI is a general purpose technology, and so it requires a general purpose, and all-hands-on-deck approach to understanding it. And I want to thank Steve Orsini and the staff and team at the Council of Ontario Universities, and the board, frankly, for embracing this. And perhaps, this is part of the way of showing that the force is not irresistible, and the object is not immovable. But that will be for everyone in this room to decide.
I think we will need a practical and collaborative approach to many of these questions that on the institutional side involve students, faculty and staff, students, faculty, and staff, requiring governments at all levels and my colleague, Minister Quinn and I, we’re in receipt of the recommendations that are directed towards our governments. But I think if we, and in particular if we listen to the students—and I know Vass would take this counsel to heart, including the very well-addressed York Engineering student—if we listen to the students, if we listen to their fears, and their opportunities that they are seeing, that we can maybe take the best of this storied institution, and collaboratively on behalf of Canadians, and within our institutions with students, faculty and staff, constructively engage, and ultimately benefit from this life-changing technology. Thank you.
Concluding Remarks by Saurabh Popat
Thank you Karim and thank you again to our panellists, sponsors, and of course, to all of you for joining us here today. I’d also like to take a moment to recognize all the wonderful students and young leaders here. Their presence is made possible through our charitable arm, the Empire Club Foundation, and the generosity of our donors. This—please stand, if you’re the students here today. Please. They’re not AI-generated images. They’re real. The support from our donors enables us to invite future leaders to take part in today’s dialogue, and to empower them to turn knowledge into leadership that shines in communities, boardrooms, and national conversations shaping Canada’s future.
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I hope you’ll join us for our next luncheon. On June the 4th, we welcome Lieutenant-General Michael Wright, Commander of the Canadian Army, for a keynote on modernizing our land forces. Following his remarks, Jody Thomas will moderate an expert panel on how the public and private sectors can collaborate to defend our country’s sovereignty. Tickets are now on sale.
And as always, as a club of record, the Empire Club events are available to watch and to listen to on our website, and the recording of today’s event will be available very shortly. Thank you all for being a part of this important conversation. This meeting is now adjourned.
