January 22, 2026
The Empire Club of Canada Presents
It’s About Time: Martin Imbleau, President and CEO, ALTO
Chairman: Saurabh Popat, President, Board of Directors, Empire Club of Canada
Moderator
Sean Speer, Co-Founder & Editor-at-Large, the Hub
Distinguished Guest Speaker
Martin Imbleau, President and CEO, ALTO
Head Table Guests
Jean-Louis Sevranckx, President & CEO, AECON Group Inc
Marie-Claude Dumas, President, WSP Canada
Welcome Address by Saurabh Popat, President, Board of Directors, Empire Club of Canada
Good afternoon, everyone. Welcome. I’m Saurabh Popat, the Chair of the Board here at the Empire Club of Canada, and your host for today’s event.
To formally begin, I would like to acknowledge that we are gathering on the Traditional and Treaty Lands of the Mississaugas of the Credit, and the homelands of the Anishinaabe, the Haudenosaunee, and the Wendat Peoples. I encourage you all to learn more about the Traditional Territory on which you work and live.
Now, today’s event would not be possible without the generous support of our sponsors. The Empire Club is a not-profit organization, and our sponsors generously support the club, and make these events possible and complimentary for our online viewers to attend. So, please take a moment, and join me in thanking our Lead Sponsors, Hydro One, AECON, and WSP. Thank you to our VIP Reception Sponsors, the Ontario Road Builders Association, and LiUNA. Thank you. And we’re also deeply appreciative of the ongoing support of our Lead Season Sponsors, Bruce Power, Hydro One, and National Bank Capital Markets. Thank you. And of course, our VIP Season Sponsors, Ellis Don, McKinsey & Company, ORBA, and Waste Connections of Canada. Thank you all. And finally, thank you to our Media Partner, the Toronto Star, and our AV Partner, Bespoke Audio Visual.
If you have questions for our speakers today, please scan the QR code found on your program, or through the Q&A function, if you’re online. For those of you online, if you require technical assistance, please use the chat feature.
Now, today’s conversation is happening at a moment when Canada is being asked by its leadership and by the world to step forward confidently. Now, earlier this week, Prime Minister Carney earned a standing ovation and global recognition with his remarks to the global leaders at the World Economic Forum in Davos. He spoke about the rising influence of middle powers like Canada, and about how, together, we have the economic strength, the institutional credibility, and the political stability to help create a more just and more resilient world. Furthermore, we are no longer relying on just the strength of our values, but also on the value of our strength. And here at home, we are building that strength day by day.
His message was clear. The signs are out of the window, and the old order of things has passed away. This means that the next phase of our shared history belongs to those who are prepared to invest, to coordinate, and to lead. And ladies and gentlemen, Canada truly exemplifies this. Across energy, critical minerals, advanced manufacturing, and infrastructure, not to mention our beloved Blue Jays, Canada has renowned clarity about what we need to build, and how we need to build, and why it matters. We have a newfound purpose, newfound energy, and a newfound sense of unity, as well as newfound certainty about our place in an uncertain world.
That brings us here today for a discussion about high-speed rail. Now, rail has always been at the centre of Canada’s national story—we’re here sitting at the Fairmont Hotel, a former CP hotel. But high-speed rail is a whole new chapter, one that has been a long time coming, and one that will demonstrate the value of our collective strength. Just this week, our keynote speaker admitted in a CBC interview that we missed the boat in the 1980’s, so in 2026, it’s even more required than before. So, let’s do it for real this time.
It certainly may be overdue, but Alto is a North American first, a bold, timely, and strategic investment in our productivity, in our labour mobility, in clean growth and national integration, at a time when all of that matters more than ever. Above all, it makes a confident statement about Canadian engineering, Canadian workers, Canadian supply chains, and Canada’s ability to deliver complex projects at scale. And it is a statement that we, here in Canada, can do great things, and that we remain masters in our own house. Our first railway built our nation. Our next railway will consolidate our nation. It will be proof that we are choosing to build, choosing to lead, and choosing to invest in the systems that will carry Canada forward. And here at the Empire Club of Canada, we continue to be the place where our greatest experts gather to discuss urgent matters of timely importance to Canadians.
Now, before we hear from our keynote speaker, it’s important to recognize the partners who will help bring big ideas like this from vision to reality. That’s why it’s my pleasure to introduce our Lead Sponsor, AECON Group Incorporated, a company that has helped to build Canada’s infrastructure, and shape its economic backbone for over 150 years. From GO expansion and the revitalization of Union Station, to participation in Montreal’s REM, AECON has helped deliver some of the most important rail projects in recent history, as well as massive projects in nuclear, utilities, civil, and industrial settings. To share a few words on behalf of AECON, please join me in welcoming Jean-Louis Sevranckx, its president and CEO.
Opening Remarks by Jean-Louis Sevranckx, President & CEO, AECON Group Inc.
Obviously, today is a great day. The wait is over. Canada and Canadians will finally be able to enjoy a high-speed train journey. And as you were telling, we missed the boat, had a few occasions, or we were sleeping, but during this time, other countries were not sleeping. Do you know how many kilometres of high-speed line do you have in China today? 35,000, and something like 15,000 under detailed engineering or construction. Spain has more than 3,500 kilometre, very strong. Japan, more than 2,500, France, 2,500 or 3,000. Morocco, more than 200 kilometre, and Canada at none. Wherever high-speed train have been implemented, it’s an absolute game changer for the businesses. It’s a superb accelerator of growth. I do not know one single country who will regret to have launched the adventure.
At AECON, we know Martin for quite a long time now. I mean, Martin has an impressive and very atypical bio that you can all see on internet, but he was president and CEO of Port of Montréal when we first knew him, and especially for the Port of Contrecœur, in Montréal. Martin is a formidable leader, but be careful, he’s a very, very tough negotiator. But what is sure is that he put this project into a box. This project is part of the first five nation-building projects, and this project today is under construction at the moment I’m speaking in front of you, at the Empire Club. We are convinced that you will make it happen with high-speed train, as you did when everybody was thinking it was impossible on the Port of Contrecœur. Thank you for this.
As per AECON, as you said, I mean, we are, as a Canadian infrastructure leader, we have become extremely competent in everything related with rail. It may be LRTs, or train electrification, all those projects. We have almost 10 projects of this kind. So, we are getting ready. We are setting up the best team we can, to be able to participate to this adventure. And today, in the name of all Canadian engineering company, and all Canadian contractor company, I just wanted to tell you, Martin, we are ready now. You can count on us.
[Video Is Shown]
Martin Imbleau, President & CEO, ALTO
Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you so much, Saurabh, for the invite. Thank you for the Empire Club, for bringing together such a diverse and engaged audience. And before I go any further, I want to thank Chief Benedict for being with us today. Your leadership is critical to ensure that this project creates real economic opportunities for Indigenous communities. Thanks again. Mr. Chair, thanks again for your confidence.
Jean-Louis has mentioned it. Many years ago, Canada had a big idea, linking our largest cities to significantly shrink distances, just like European countries were actually doing it. From Toronto to Montréal, to Ottawa in two hours, Toronto to Peterborough in less than one, Montréal to Toronto in three hours, rain or shine, cutting travel times in half. To quote Rick Mercer, “Canada is the world leader in high-speed rail reports.” And he’s right. For decades, high-speed rail showed up on Wishlist, was debated, studied, shelved again and again. But around this date last year, it all became real with ALTO, Canada’s first high-speed rail network connecting Toronto to Quebec City. And recently, on December 12th, Minister McKinnon and I announced that its first phase will connect Ottawa to Montréal and its construction will start in ‘29, 2030. So, for the first time, we can point to three cities, and say this is where we start building ALTO. And my message today is simple. It is a call to action to start preparing to build it together.
2025 was a pivotal year. It marked the moment ALTO became real. It came from a concept to something very real. So, the question is not anymore why, it’s how. How do we make mobility a true catalyst for lasting prosperity? How do we deliver something that will serve Canadians for generations to come? We’ve assembled a super team. We’ve launched a pre-construction phase with Cadence, our private partner. Work is progressing on all fronts, technical, environmental, and the very key Indigenous community engagement.
But what gives this project even more credibility, I think, is how we are actually developing it, and in what sequence. That approach is built on the partnership model designed to protect the public interest, while benefiting from the private sector expertise. So, this infrastructure will remain publicly owned. The tracks, the station will remain Canada’s property. And as a dedicated project office, ALTO’s role is to protect that public interest, with a strong oversight and disciplined governance.
Just as important, Cadence, with Lacaze, and my colleague Danielle that is here with us today, brings hands-on experience in managing major projects here in Canada, but also, expertise in operating high-speed rail from around the world. Additionally, Lacaze and Cadence will contribute capital to the project, and the CIB also intends to participate financially in the project. So, that’s what defines the shared delivery model. Each participant plays their role with a single unified structure, but established for the long term. That allows us to move forward with discipline, and meet today’s standard and tomorrow’s expectations.
I have a feeling one of the burning questions in this room today is, why not start in Toronto? Well, simply put, integrating high-speed rail into Toronto means threading it through one of the most constrained transportation systems in North America. Toronto is not where you experiment. It is where you apply what you have learned. Ottawa-Montréal is a distance we can manage more responsibly, and use as a learning ground. But it also enables us to leverage skilled labours about in two provinces, and that is very key.
And above all, it’s sound project management practices. You start with a defined scope. You sequence the work properly. You validate your assumptions early. You learn, and then you apply the same rigor, and expand with greater agility east and west. Don’t get me wrong. It’s still a very large project, with 200 kilometre of tracks, and three stations to build. And I want to be absolutely clear about one thing. Toronto is not being sidelined. The project does not succeed without Toronto at its core. And that reality is reflected in how we’re sequencing the work. So development work here, but also in Peterborough, Quebec City, will advance, and will accelerate in parallel of the construction of the first segment.
So, you’ll understand it is too early to present very specific locations for a station. We’re exploring different options in each of the seven cities. Getting in town in downtown Toronto presents its own sets of challenge. It’s a very dense, and heavily used urban environment. And getting to the city is only part of the challenge. We also need to integrate our 300 kilometre-per-hour trains with local transit networks, to ensure the system flows seamlessly for decades to come. And yes, Union Station is absolutely being considered, but yes, it is not the only option on the table. So, I know there’s a lot of anticipation, and that’s understandable. I’m just asking you for a little bit more patience. And after all, Torontonians have mastered the art of patience since what? 1967, I’m told.
Joking aside, joking aside, this approach really strikes a right balance, and avoids land speculation that would otherwise increase costs for Canada. And at the heart of this project, there are extraordinary opportunities and jobs, but also, a clear need to prepare. For the first time in generations, Canada is building something that will redefine how we live, we move, and we connect across this country. And there’s pride in that, national pride. And knowing that Alto will be built largely by Canadian workers, with Canadian materials, and drawing on best practices from around the world.
Building a thousand-kilometre network requires tons of materials, crazy level of engineering, and people, lots of people. Well, because of that, Alto will set entire sections and entire sectors in motion. And the Build and Buy Canada policy will also act as a true powerful lever to develop and scale Canadian industries. Just for the tracks, we need 4,000 kilometres of steel tracks. That is the equivalent of 10 times the round trip to the space station. For the first segment alone, we’re talking thousands of tons of steel, but also of concrete, copper, aluminum. And that’s why we’ve already begun direct outreach to the Canada steel industry.
With Cadence, we’re already engaging producers now to understand their readiness, and the readiness in general of the domestic supply chain. Because 2030 is tomorrow. And construction will also call for an army of expertise and workforce. It’s actually 50,000 people that will be required, enough to fill seat at the Scotiabank Arena two-and-a-half times over. So, we’re talking about what? Welders, surveyors, electricians, signal and communication technician to keep the trains running safely at full speed, construction crews to build bridges, tunnels, electrified tracks, all with millimeter precision. We also need crane operators and heavy equipment mechanics. So, my message to you today is simple. The time to prepare is today. That’s why also we’ll closely collaborate also with universities, colleges, professional school to develop training capacities.
So, with Cadence, we will soon start meeting with construction firms of course, construction association, and union partners, to assess their readiness to answer our common calls to market. And we have a responsibility to make sure that we reach every community, including Indigenous peoples. From early design and environmental work through construction, we want to build the condition for Indigenous-owned businesses and workers to participate fully in the project in a way that creates lasting economic benefits for the communities. So in short, the network will be an industrial accelerator, a weapon of mass construction.
And it’s not only about building a rail, it’s about productivity and the logic, it’s simple. Shorter travel times between economic centres make distances smaller. Labour markets get bigger. Employers draw from a wider talent pool. Workers can access more jobs without having to relocate. Businesses spend less time moving people and more time producing. And that’s when productivity starts to translate into opportunities. At its core, Alto is about investing in us, for us, here at home.
And we know our mobility is critical to a country’s economic performance. Connecting communities is key to driving growth. It stimulates cultural exchanges, and sparks the conditions for innovation to thrive. Everyone in this room knows how much the country needs it. Connecting 40% of the country’s population and strengthening our economy is key for generations to come. By 20, our population expand, travel demand in the corridor is projected to grow by 30, 40%.
Well, even maintaining today’s level of mobility will require huge investment. Without Alto, that capacity will have to come from somewhere else. So in fact, the question is not whether the question will invest in transport capacity—they always do—the question is where. Alto is a generational investment in Canada’s economic future. One that will have a 25 billion impact on our GDP. That’s a monumental boost equivalent to 1.1% of our annual GDP. That is the scale of what Alto represent. And without high speed rail network, we’ve heard it, our economy will simply fall further behind G20 nation. And the longer we wait, the harder bill will be economically, environmentally and socially, inertia comes with a price tag, and we’re simply not rich enough to pay for it.
And you know, there’s one thing I hate is the unicity syndrome. Canada is not an exception. We’ve seen what high speed rail has done everywhere in the world. In France, the TGV created the domestic supply chain that employs tens of thousands of people. And the country is now smaller in the best way. In Spain, we’ve heard it, 3,000 kilometre built in 30 years. What’s more interesting is that Spanish rail unlocked demand no one saw coming. On the Madrid to Barcelona corridor, 30% of the passengers are ones that did not travel before, period. High speed rail changed that. They began moving regularly between the countries to main economic centre, despite the distance of 600 kilometres between them. Increased productivity came with people travelling more often, creating more opportunities, all because the train was faster, more convenient, and more affordable. Well, the law of gravity is strong, and is the same everyone. Rail simply became naturally the dominant mode between the two cities. Canada is no different. Toronto to Montréal is actually a very similar corridor. Alta will connect, in three hours, French and English speaking Canadians, will bring the two largest economic centres also separated by 600 kilometre.
So it’s about giving you time, a lot of time, and bring our lives and cities closer together. And this comes at a time when internal East-West connections matter, I believe, more than ever. Well, let me give you a clear picture of what Alto will mean for you. 20 to 25 departures a day, every 30 minutes at peak time. Flexibility to choose from early meetings to evening visits with family, rain or shine. The journey itself will be part of the experience. Productive, relaxing, enjoyable, fast, frequent, reliable. With station integrated into local transit networks, opening the door to a wide range of urban development, we hope, including housing.
So, what does this mean concretely? Well, it’s about picking the right alignment, buying rolling stock, preparing the ground, laying ballast, then tracks, installing electrification and signal system, building stations and maintenance centres, step by step, kilometre by kilometre. It is a major undertaking. But again, it’s about replicating what has been done elsewhere. And as we move forward, an important step, of course, will be how we approach land access. We will need to acquire land across multiple region. And what will truly matters is how we do it. So, with respect and a clear understanding of the realities of the landowners. We simply don’t approach things the same way in dense urban environments, in suburban communities, or in farmland areas. They each have their different expectations and concerns.
And we also need to be clear about the constraints of a high-speed rail. It requires a straight alignment, with very limited and gentle curves. Those requirements are the ones guaranteeing we truly reduce travel times, but they also limit the flexibility in how the line can be laid out. So, our priority is to have willing seller, willing buyer agreements, and build respectful relationship with landowners. Expropriation, an understandably loaded word, will remain a tool both to help move transaction forward, but also to ensure Canada delivers on its promise. But we are committed to communicating clearly, and acting with respect toward those who will be impacted.
And it’s in the same spirit that we are approaching what comes next. Yesterday, we opened the door to your participation, and launched a public consultation across the corridor. Our online consultation platform went live. So, over the next three months, we’ll present the project to you, but more importantly, we will be listening. What we hear will directly shape how Alto is designed. These conversations will help us refine the alignment and make better decisions. I’ve said it, I think on day one, Alto will succeed if and only if it is built in collaboration with communities.
So obviously, we can’t give all the answers on day one. A consultation where everything is already decided, it’s not a consultation, it is a sales pitch. So, listening now, before decision are made, is what creates clarity going forward. Thirty years in, I can tell you this, the work you do upfront makes all the difference, and it’s what sets major project up for success. The Prime Minister has recently made it clear, Alto is a transformative strategy for the country, and Canadians need to see the benefit as soon as possible. So, this is what we’re working on. 2026 is about consultation, refining the alignment, and coming back to the communities at the end of the year with a very precise proposal.
In ‘27, ‘28, we will work on the engineering stuff, and getting the permits. In ‘29, market preparation translate into contracts being awarded, and work with utilities, and the first underground activities. And by the end of 2030, well, we start the construction in Ottawa, Montréal, and between the corridors, between the cities. But I’m not going to lie, it is a very ambitious timeline, but a doable one if we prepare correctly.
Of course building, this means being honest about the challenges ahead. There will be questions, there will be skepticism. It will test our coordination across jurisdiction, and our capacity to stay the course over many years. It won’t be easy. Project like this is never hard, but challenges do not make this project less necessary. Alto demand rigor and unwavering conviction. Once fully operational, Alto will account for 24 million trips a year. 24 million connections and opportunities. But to get there, people will have to choose it day in, day out, in large number.
Everywhere, experience shows that behaviour changes when two conditions come together. A service travellers can rely on, and prices that feel competitive. Because people don’t break down trips into fuel, parking, or security lines. They think of it in simple terms. How long does it take? How complicated is it? And how much does it cost? So, Alto is not a niche service for the happy few. Our objective is to reshape how millions of people move along the corridor by offering an alternative that is accessible to all, including the eight million Canadians who live today with a disability. We want Alto to be the obvious choice for all, period.
Imagine stepping into a train in Peterborough on a snowy day, and getting to Toronto before your coffee even cools off. Think about a Montréal Jays fan wants to come catch a game on a Sunday afternoon, and head back home the same night. Well, with Alto, that kind of trip becomes the reality, not the exception. Families will spend less time on the road, and more time together, opportunities once out of reach will finally be within a train’s distant ride. Our cities will feel closer, our days will be longer, and our country will feel smaller in all the right ways. Thank you.
Saurabh Popat
Thank you. Thank you so much. Merci beaucoup, Martin. That was fantastic. Truly a nation-building spirit in Alto, and I for one am looking forward to not only the journey ahead, but the end state, as well. So, thank you very much. Please join me in thanking Martin again, for a timely and forward-looking keynote. Martin now outlined what this project could mean for Canada’s economy, and all Canadians in our most densely populated areas. Its workforce, its long-term competitiveness, and reminding us why the moment to build is now. And for your work every day to turn ambition into reality for all Canadians.
But we’re not done just yet. We’re pleased, very, very pleased to be joined by Sean Speer today. Sean is the co-founder and editor-at-large of The Hub, a leading platform for informed debate on Canadian policy and politics. He’s also a senior fellow with Carleton University’s Riddell Graduate Program for Political Management, University of Toronto’s Munk School of Global Affairs and Public Policy, and the Public Policy Forum. Sean is a public policy expert and economic strategist, and has supported and led national decision-making. He also served as a senior advisor to former Prime Minister Stephen Harper. He’ll be sharing this conversation with a wider audience through a future episode of The Hub Podcast. Sean, thank you so much for joining us. Please come to the stage, and begin the conversation.
Sean Speer, Co-Founder & Editor-at-Large, the Hub
Thank you very much. Congratulations on the remarks, Martain. It’s clear from the audience here today that the project and what it represents is galvanizing people at this unique moment for our country. And we’ll talk a bit about the project in the time that we have. Before we get there, I wanna ask a bit about Alto itself. Talk about the decision to spin it off of Via Rail and why you think that’s necessary to ultimately succeed with this project.
Martin Imbleau
That was a great, courageous decision. It’s something that Canada does not do, typically. So we are an affiliate of Via, but it’s really a standalone. And the intent, I think it was not to contaminate operation with project development. It’s so big that you need to have a dedicated team, a dedicated board. Rob Pritchard is here. He was there when it was created. And the idea is use the best practices at the governance level, as you would basically do in the private sector. So, it’s different, it’s very agile, it’s independent, and it gives us the flexibility to move forward. So, we support our friend at Via, but we report directly to the Ministry of Transport, and it’s being very efficient. If you look at what we’ve accomplished in 24 months, it’s not the type of decision that come that fast, when you don’t have that agility.
Sean Speer
You mentioned Rob Pritchard as the chair of the new entity. It speaks to the urgency and the priority that’s being placed on the project. One of the consequences, though, of creating a new entity is that you’ve had to stand it up, basically, from scratch. Talk a bit about that. What has that experience been like? What has surprised you? And how’s it going?
Martin Imbleau
First, it’s going very well. But it’s been an interesting two-years-and-a-half. The chair called me close to three years ago, and he said, “I only know one person that is good enough, but also crazy enough to make this happen.” And even the board was not completed back then. So, we basically started from scratch, but with the right ingredients. And it’s all about people completing the board. We have seven super board members, with diversified expertise and experience. And I had the opportunity to pick every single colleagues at Alto. We’re now 200 people…
Sean Speer
Wow.
Martin Imbleau
…some of them are in the room. The best, Allen from Toronto, Montréal abroad, a great Spanish leadership. Marisa is with us today. I thank her for trusting me, and coming over. She led the high-speed rail network in Spain. She decided to move, and come to Montréal. That’s great confidence demonstration. So, it’s been fun, challenging, but it’s all about people, and it really changed our life when Canada selected Cadence and [Indiscernible] to lead this, six great companies, including SSAF. So, it’s a great partnership that was created. Unique, but going well.
Sean Speer
We’re starting to get some questions from the audience, and I’d encourage you to submit them. We’ll get to as many as we can, before we wrap up. And as you addressed head on in your remarks, Martin, there are questions about this project because it’s been permeating in our policy and politics for so long, ostensibly, before you accepted Rob’s urging to take on this job, you thought a bit about why it hadn’t happened in the past, and how we assure Canadians that this time is different. How have you come to think about that? What has stood in the way, and how are you going about systematically trying to address those previous impediments or barriers?
Martin Imbleau
I’m a big user of high-speed rail, when I travelled in Europe. It just doesn’t make any sense not to have that. I was in Québec City last week. It took me four-hours-and-a-half to get to Montréal for a medical appointment. I left Montréal yesterday morning, took me six hours to get to Toronto. I spent thousands of dollars of—it’s just not productive, so it should be done. So, what we brought, we think very honestly, is the linear project approach. So, it’s being consistent, knowing that your reality changes, being very patient on the long term. But one thing that Ottawa does not typically do is being impatient on the short term. So, establish the milestone, respect the calendars, and be pushy. Respect that. That’s what Canadians are expecting. And I think we’ve demonstrated that the credibility is there, because we’ve respected our objective so far.
QUESTIONS & ANSWERS
Sean Speer
I thought one of the most interesting parts of your remarks was when you addressed the subject of demand, and how you and your colleagues are thinking about demand. We have a question from the audience, it sort of gets at that point. How do you strike the balance that you were talking about between maintaining price competitiveness and attractiveness with other modes of transportation?
Martin Imbleau
What I like about the mandate that the chair and I receive is about the ridership. The mandate is ensuring that people change how they commute. So, the profitability of it is not in the infrastructure. It’s in the usage of it.
Sean Speer
Yes.
Martin Imbleau
If 25 million Canadians per year use it, as we are contemplating, it’s going to be a game changer. So, it has to be very affordable. Madrid to Barcelona, the example I’ve used before, then yet I’m going to quote you, 10 euros. You jump on the high speed rail for 10 euros, and you’re in Madrid. Of course, you pay in advance, and everything. So, we’ll have a very affordable entry ticket price, a normal ticket price. And you, business community, will pay much more, being comfortable in the Wi-Fi, and everything. But the mandate is about ridership. So, that’s why picking the stations, and the alignment is so key. The success is the number of people who use it.
Sean Speer
I don’t want to get too wonky here. But if I can just follow up, without getting into excruciating details. Can you let us in a bit on how you and your colleagues think about demand, how you go about analyzing prospective demand, and how that informs the decisions you make?
Martin Imbleau
It’s based on best practices. We’ve studied, we have a group internally that studies that. Cadence has one, also, and we basically share the assumption. You look at behaviour, but not of yesterday…
Sean Speer
Yes.
Martin Imbleau
…behaviour of today and tomorrow.
Sean Speer
Yes.
Martin Imbleau
There’s 800,000 post-secondary students in the corridor. They will all be using that service. They don’t today, but they’re paying for a second apartment or a second car, because there is no option. So, it’s behaviour study, and European standards. So, we have experts coming from Europe, and also local expertise. You do that type of studies, also. Just met a professor that said to me, a few weeks ago, we need to be as tight for the Toronto expansion and the Montréal metro expansion. So, it’s a good recipe. And it’s established science.
Sean Speer
You rightly talked about the workforce issues that are fundamental to this project. I think you mentioned 50,000, which is interesting, and obviously, significant. We have a question from the audience, though, about how you go about fulfilling that workforce demand, particularly in a world where—cross our fingers—you’re competing with other mega projects in other parts of the country. Why don’t you talk a bit about that?
Martin Imbleau
That’s a reality. It’s a concern, a bit. In Québec, Ontario, Hydro Québec has massive, massive projects, some of which require talents similar to us. Here, Metrolinx is still doing a fantastic expansion, requiring a lot of talents. So, workforce is one key element. So, we want to benefit from workers leaving a site, and then coming to us. And I’ve said that one of the reasons why we’ve picked Ottawa to Montréal as the first segment is to touch the basin of talent in both provinces.
But there’s also another element that we should start focusing on, is the construction consortium, or size. We do have an expectation where we will see larger consortium, larger firms getting together, because the contracts that we will be signing with the construction industries are not gonna be small ones.
Sean Speer
Yes.
Martin Imbleau
They’re gonna be significant ones. And the Canadian construction industries is probably not as ready as expected. So, we need to work with the associations. So, when Daniel signs a contract, it’s multi-billion. So, we need decent size of consortium. So, even if you’re competing today, get friendly with your competitor, and be ready to sign larger contracts.
Sean Speer
Well, that’s a good segue. It anticipates a question, a specific question from the audience, which is, what are three things that contractors can do now to prepare for construction in 2029, ‘30?
Martin Imbleau
Workforce, visibility on workforce, governance and structure. You need to think today who will be your partners to compete for those contract. That needs to happen, really, in ‘27, ‘28. The third one, I’ve said it on another platform, we will be looking for innovation way, not on the technology—we don’t want to repeat, we want to repeat stuff, we don’t want to invent the wheel again—but the way to build it, notably, for winter construction activities. So, how to limit the winter impact on the construction season so we don’t break too often, we protect the workers correctly, including in remote areas. When you’re north of Peterborough, the condition could be pretty harsh, so we need the innovation by those consortiums, and how they think they will be able to keep the cadence in the construction.
Sean Speer
I asked a bit about how you project forward demands and thinking about known unknowns, and unknown unknowns. We have a really interesting question about how you project forward technology itself. How are you thinking, Martin, about alternatives to high speed rail, and ensuring that over time, as this project proceeds and ultimately is constructed, that we don’t risk obsolescence?
Martin Imbleau
Fair question. I actually have a concern that is the opposite.
Sean Speer
Interesting.
Martin Imbleau
Which is the scope creep, and do with the project everything that everyone wants you to do and think about. I prefer to go with a project scope that is limited, that is grounded, and you’re laser focused and what you’re achieving here. I have no concern about the obsolescence of high speed rail. The question is going faster and faster, even Madrid to Barcelona. They’re looking at ways to reduce the duration of the trip from three hours to two hours. So, the no regret move is ensuring that we don’t call something today that will limit the improvement of the system, and being more efficient going faster, but not necessarily having another mode of transport.
Sean Speer
Given the nature of the project and its lifespan, it necessarily bucks up against broader political calendars and political trends. And we have a couple of questions. One about a forthcoming election in the province of Québec, and another about just the general volatility of our politics. How are you and your colleagues thinking about that as a potential risk for the project, and ways to mitigate it?
Martin Imbleau
We think about it, but we have no stress about it. The last 24 months were not the most foreseeable period. And we went through this. We will have many election cycle in Ottawa, many election cycle in Queen’s Park, in Québec. How many hundreds of election on the municipal level for the next 15 years. Our job is be very grounded, and ensuring that Canadians still want this, are supporting, and they know what’s coming. If the electors want this, and have confidence that we’re doing the right job, they’re saying to their MP and all other elected officials that this should go ahead. If we do our work, we’ll go through that period.
Sean Speer
As I said at the outset, you should be credited for directly addressing skepticism that people might have, not just about this particular project, but about our capacity to do something of this magnitude and scale. Why don’t you address that directly? How are you thinking about this project against the backdrop of people growing accustomed to project delays, and project crossover runs in other major transit projects across the country?
Martin Imbleau
I’m so glad that this question came. In Canada, we keep doing the same mistake. We make political promises, we throw numbers, dates, and without doing the proper work. Our budget is not known. We have a working estimate today, because I cannot have a budget if I don’t know the alignment, haven’t done the proper engineering. You will have my budget when I’ve done my job, and then you will challenge me to respect it. Not a number that I will have thrown two years ago, when I didn’t know enough. That’s what Canada does too often. Second, in the same phrase in Québec, in Canada and Ontario, we say, “Ah, it’s too big, we can’t do it,” and so on. In the same phrase, we should have done it 40 years ago. The time to do it is now.
Sean Speer
I asked about what construction companies can be doing to prepare. There’s a really interesting question about what local communities should be doing to prepare. If your vision manifests itself, this is going to have a multiplier effect on various parts of the country. How can they seize on the benefits for themselves and their citizens?
Martin Imbleau
If you allow me, outside of the corridor, Alto has already been in touch with the Alberta department that is looking at high-speed rail, or fast train between Edmonton and Calgary. It’s a corridor that is interesting, has good feature, not that difficult to build. So, it’s something that could be replicated there. But we need workers from across the country. In my previous life, I saw tens of thousands of Québec workers and welders leaving Québec to go in Fort McMurray and build the gas patch, the oil patch. Well, we need the workers from BC, from Alberta, and from New Brunswick, coming to support this. And you saw the GDP impact. It’s just, we just get richer as a nation with this being in place.
Sean Speer
You mentioned Buy Canadian. There’s a couple of questions along those lines. Talk about the potential role for Canadian suppliers, how you’re thinking about prospective international players, and balancing the potential tension between providing real value for Canada, while delivering a cost-effective and ultimately efficient project.
Martin Imbleau
Well, I think in your question, you hit the nail. It’s a balancing act. So, of course, we will try to maximize local benefits. It’s a civil construction. So, just to start with that, you know that most of it is locally produced. You need ballast. You need a lot of stuff that come very regionally. Steel tracks is a concern. That’s why I’ve mentioned it, because we need a big chunk of it. Not one single metre of steel tracks are being produced in Canada. So, of course, we started with that. The next big component is gonna be rolling stock.
Sean Speer
M’hm (affirmative).
Martin Imbleau
So, of course, we will look at how can we supply this locally, but we need the competitive tension to ensure that the cost is right, and we pick the right technology for generations to come. But the incentive is gonna be to look in our backyard as much as possible.
Sean Speer
There’s a question here that someone submitted with whom I have a mind meld. I travel a lot for work, and I’ve found myself stuck in airport delays a lot lately, because of weather. So, we’re talking about a lot of big, high-minded things here. But why don’t you just address directly the subject of Canadian winters, and the capacity of high-speed rail to minimize the disruption that a lot of us face travelling, due to the climate and weather.
Martin Imbleau
Extreme weather affects transportation system, affects highway, airport, train system. So, it’s not, it’s no secret. I left Montréal yesterday morning. I was on a ten o’clock flight, was able to take the eight o’clock flight, and we were 90 minutes late, so that’s why it took me six hours. And I said to myself, “I could be in a station and be downtown Toronto in three hours.”
Sean Speer
Yes.
Martin Imbleau
So, we need this for that reason, but we need also, with Cadence and SNCF, to pick the right technology today. Yes, winter is a concern. But the icing condition, when it’s minus two, minus three, minus four, this is where Canada gets tricky, because of the icing condition. Well, that happens in Italy, and France, and Sweden. The amount of snow is important. So, picking the right technology, and deploying what has been tested is gonna be very, very key. But of course, you don’t run at 350, when it’s minus 35 and there’s a snowstorm. Winter affects all transportation systems.
Sean Speer
You focused on Indigenous collaboration and cooperation in your remarks. Talk about, as you launch these outreach sessions, which I think began yesterday, how you and your team are engaging affected Indigenous communities.
Martin Imbleau
Actually, the consultation and the relationship with the Indigenous communities has started before what we’ve done yesterday with the other communities. Our intent—of course, respecting the duty to consult is just the basic of it. But it’s just such a massive possibility of creating economic benefit in the communities for workers, for young people. But also, this is a Canadian infrastructure. It’s an opportunity to have the communities invest in the project, and be partner for decades to come. So, that’s the type of relationship that we are trying to build. And we have a fantastic team leading this. We’ve started engaging with the communities for, what, two years now?
Sean Speer
Okay.
Martin Imbleau
But the economic benefit and the participation are gonna be two of the most important goals of Alto. I’m looking at the team, looking at Chief Benedict, for the next couple of years.
Sean Speer
One of the things I really liked about your remarks is you laid out some pretty clear guideposts or milestones for what people can expect over the next four or five years. Talk a bit more about that, Martin. It seems to me that the best way to manage people’s skepticism is what Ronald Reagan called trust but verify. So, what are those, talk a bit more about those milestones or guideposts, and how you see them unfolding.
Martin Imbleau
I think what create trust is committing at the right time, and delivering on that. Sometimes, team members say to me, “Don’t commit too soon.” But if we can commit, that’s because we have the information to commit, it forces also the political decision to come at the right time.
Sean Speer
Yes.
Martin Imbleau
Because setting out long-term objectives is not the most difficult part. It is not managing the noise on a weekly basis. That’s when projects are derailed.
Sean Speer
Yes.
Martin Imbleau
Every single week there’s a news where the political focus will be something else. My job is the long-term, establishing the goals, respecting that. It needs to be pushy, it needs to be a bit aggressive. But I need the private sector to do this. A Crown Corporation alone cannot do that type of infrastructure. We need the innovation, and we need the capitalism, and patience to make this happen.
Sean Speer
Someone asked a question that I was too polite to ask, but it’s an important one.
Martin Imbleau
Go ahead.
Sean Speer
What keeps you up at night? What’s your greatest concern for the project, and how are you approaching to address it head on?
Martin Imbleau
I sleep well at night, because I go to bed at 8:15, and I wake up at 4:30 in the morning. So, that’s my habit. But that’s why I sleep well, but I wake early with a lot of stuff to think about. For me it’s talent, talent, talent. If we have the right people to deal with at Cadence, if we have the right management support, if we have the right people doing it, doing their job and supporting it. Project never failed because of technical constraint, they failed because we get distracted, and we don’t have the right people doing the right stuff at the right time. So, it’s always gonna be about talents.
Sean Speer
Do us a favour, project forward past 2030, and paint a picture of what this means for the country, so us collectively, and for those in the room individually. How will this be transformative, as you and the prime minister have put it?
Martin Imbleau
So 2030 we start building the first segment—probably seven years, maybe eight, maybe six, it’s gonna depend. So, the operation will start in the corridor between Ottawa and Québec, in maybe ’37, or something like this. It seems far away, but it’s coming fast. And we will start developing Toronto maybe a couple of years after we start building the first segment. What that will mean is the 800,000 students I’ve mentioned before, they will travel in the corridor way more efficiently, cheaper. And the Montréalers don’t come that often to Toronto. Torontonians don’t go to Montréal that often, because it’s costly, takes a long time. Just the cultural exchanges. We talk about sporting events—he’s an Habs fan by the way.
Sean Speer
We’re not gonna hold it against him.
Martin Imbleau
I joked about it, but having more people coming to the playoffs, economically, it creates one big economic zone of Toronto, Ottawa, Québec, Montréal. So, the capital of the two largest cities. So, we become now a pool of attraction that competes with the New York, Boston, or Washington, or LA Region. We cannot not do it working closer together to be much more productive for generations to come. We owe them that for the young generation in this room.
Sean Speer
Final question, I characterize the project as having a multiplier effect. It seems to me that the people in this room are a multiplier. What’s the final message you wanna deliver to them? What do you think they ought to take away from today’s session?
Martin Imbleau
Well, I need the help to be prepared. We don’t have all the answers, so we need your input. We will be wrong, we will fail on something, so I’ve asked for your patience, your indulgence. Come support us. If we get something wrong, we’ll change it. We’ll adapt, we’re a public service, we’re not a private entity. We’re there for your success, so don’t be shy. Come to us, help us make this a success for the next generations.
Sean Speer
Hear hear. Merci beaucoup.
Martin Imbleau
Merci. Merci beaucoup.
Saurabh Popat
Fantastic conversation. Martin, I hope you’ll be serving some Canadian wine on the high-speed rail, as well, so look forward to that. Please join me in thanking, once again, Martin Imbleau and Sean Speer, for a thoughtful and engaging discussion. Merci.
Today’s conversation showed us the scale of the opportunity before us, and the level of coordination, expertise, and long-term thinking that we need to deliver projects of this significance and magnitude. As we look ahead, it’s clear that transformational infrastructure depends on partners who understand rail systems, the valuable integrated networks that must perform safely, reliably, and sustainably over decades.
That brings me to our next speaker. Marie-Claude Dumas is president of WSP Canada, where she provides national leadership across rail and transit. WSP has helped shape some of Canada’s most complex transportation systems. It has brought together engineering excellence, systems thinking, and a strong focus on long-term performance and resilience. That depth of expertise aligns closely with the ambition behind Alto. Marie-Claude, merci beaucoup. Thank you for your leadership, WSP’s partnership, and for joining us today. Please join me, in welcoming Marie-Claude to the stage.
Note of Appreciation by Marie-Claude Dumas, President, WSP Canada
Good afternoon, everyone, and I promise I won’t be too long. I know it’s the end, and we all need to get back, want to get back to the office. Thank you, Sean and Martin, for that very interesting discussion, and I’ll try to find the podcast—I’m not the greatest at this; I’ll ask my kids, maybe—but I’ll try to find it and see what you do and how you spin this on social media. Martin, thank you for your inspiring words. You’ve captured the essence of what this moment means for Canada, it’s about time. Time to turn decades of aspiration into action. Time to build a network that doesn’t just move people, it moves ideas, talent, and opportunities across our country. This project is about building stronger communities, as you said it, better access to services, and new economic horizons. It’s about connecting families, and fuelling growth in ways that will define the next century.
At WSB, we know what rail can do because we’ve seen it, in Canada and around the world. Since designing the New York City subway in the 1880’s, we’ve led rail innovation on every continent, from Riyadh’s Metro to Qatar’s integrated program, rail program, from Britain’s high-speed rail to California’s high-speed rail, Calgary’s Green Line, and Toronto’s Eglinton West Extension, we will and have delivered projects that change how people live, work, and connect every day.
Rail has always been the backbone of Canadian commerce, now it’s about building the backbone of Canadian mobility. This is a nation-building project, one that will strengthen the economy, advance clean technology, and create sustainable connections for generations. As you said, Martin, it’s about time, and I share your excitement. On behalf of WSB, congratulations to you for leading this inspiring vision. And thank you to everyone here in the room today, for your continued commitment to expanding rail and transit networks across our country. Together, we are shaping the future of Canada. Thank you.
Concluding Remarks by Saurabh Popat
Merci beaucoup, Marie-Claude. Thank you again to our panellists, sponsors, and of course, to all of you for joining us here today. I’d also like to take a moment to recognize the students and young leaders joining us here today. Perhaps, some of them will be supporting Alto in the journey ahead. Their presence is made possible through our charitable arm, the Empire Club Foundation, and the generosity of our donors. This support enables us to invite future leaders to take part in today’s dialogue and tomorrow’s dialogue, and to empower them to turn knowledge into leadership that shines in communities, boardrooms, and national conversations shaping Canada’s future.
To stay connected, please subscribe to our newsletter by scanning the QR code on your tables. We also have an exciting new membership program. Please see our staff after the event today.
I also hope that you’ll join us for two exciting upcoming events that are, once again, timely and important. On Wednesday, February the 4th, the Empire Club of Canada will be recognizing the Toronto Blue Jays as the recipient of the 2025 Nation Builder Award at a special ceremony in downtown Toronto. Mark Shapiro, president and CEO of the Toronto Blue Jays, will accept the award on behalf of the organization, followed by an in-depth fireside conversation with Hazel May of Sportsnet. Together, they’ll reflect on how Canada’s team has shaped national pride, strengthened communities, and create impact that extends far beyond the ballpark.
And on Monday, February 17th, the Empire Club of Canada will welcome Robert Flack, Ontario’s Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing, for a keynote address called “Protecting the Dream of Home Ownership in Ontario.” As Ontario deals with rising costs, slowing house starts, and growing affordability pressures, the Minister will outline what comes next in the province’s plan to accelerate construction, cut red tape, and keep workers on the job. Attendees will hear how recent policy changes and historic investments aim to support families, attract investment, and deliver housing and infrastructure that Ontario needs for long-term economic resilience. Tickets for both events are now on sale.
And as always, as a club of record, all Empire Clubs events are available to watch and listen to on our website. The recording of today’s event will be available very shortly. Thank you all again, merci beaucoup, for being part of this important conversation. Please enjoy the networking reception. We’ll look forward to seeing you at future events. This meeting is now adjourned.
